Offering Unsolicited Botox, Photographing Hospital Patients, Using Pre-Divorce Stationery, and More

Nick: Hey, everybody. It's Nick Leighton.

Leah: And it's Leah Bonnema.

Nick: And we had so many great questions from you all in the wilderness ...

Leah: [howls]

Nick: ... that we have a bonus episode. So here we go. Our first question is quote, "I'm an outgoing, adventurous, 50-something with a wide array of interests and friends. Recently, I shared a laughter-filled dinner with a friend I'd not seen in years. In the spirit of celebration, we took a pic together, which I later posted on Instagram. In response to my post, another friendólet's call her Lisaósent me the following DM: 'Hey, girl. Message me. Friends and family discount. I'd love to Botox you.' Lisa is a licensed esthetician, so the fact that she DMed me with specific advice made it all feel somewhat urgent. While I understand that Lisa may have meant no harm, her words hurt my feelings. Was Lisa's comment rude, or am I being oversensitive about a lighthearted quip? Did I misinterpret a generous offer, or did Lisa cross a line of etiquette and kindness? Should I reply to Lisa? What is a polite response to a comment like this in the future? And just to clarify, I am a longtime friend of Lisa's, but we seldom communicate, and I've never indicated even the slightest interest in cosmetic enhancements of any kind. I don't think there's anything wrong with them, they're just not for me. I know I'm not perfect in real life or on Instagram, but I'm happy with myself and I want to enjoy all of my wonderful friends without feeling judged. Help!"

Leah: This was so interesting because she did send a picture.

Nick: Yeah, she sent us the photo in question.

Leah: And I didn't want to look, because it doesn't matter what you look like. The answer is still the same.

Nick: However ...

Leah: However, I looked.

Nick: She looks great. Yeah.

Leah: She looksóI was like, "Oh, there was four ladies with baby skin in this picture."

Nick: Yeah. So ...

Leah: So way off. Even though it doesn't matter. You know, you could be ...

Nick: It doesn't matter. But ...

Leah: But that's not what's happening.

Nick: That was not what was happening in this photograph at all. Right!

Leah: And not evenónot even, like ...

Nick: Not even close.

Leah: That being said, one never does that.

Nick: Uh, no. No. No, there's no nice way to do it.

Leah: It's like when you go in to get your nails done and they go, "Oh, do you want to lip wax?"

Nick: [laughs] Yeah. So I mean, don't comment.

Leah: Don't comment ever!

Nick: This is rude. This isóthere's nothing else to say. This is rude. Don't do this.

Leah: Actually, I don't even know if it's extra insane, because if I had, like, wrinkles and somebody commented, that's also extra insane.

Nick: Yeah. Oh, that's a good point. Yes. You don't say I need Botox no matter what I look like. Yes. Full stop.

Leah: Just don't say it.

Nick: Right. Now okay, devil's advocate. This is somebody who's in the business of selling Botox. How is Lisa supposed to drum up business? Let's assume that that's what this was.

Leah: Oh, I think that's what it is. I think our letter-writer should know this person is doing this to everybody.

Nick: Yeah. It's not personal on some level.

Leah: I think what she saw is like, "Oh, you have a group of friends. I want to make all your friends go to a Botox party and make money."

Nick: Ah, cha-ching. Yeah. Okay, that's possible.

Leah: Not that that makes it okay, but I just want our letter-writer to know this is happening across the board.

Nick: Yeah. So do I have to respond?

Leah: I mean, we could say, "Hey, Lisa. I think it's better if you want to drum up business to just do a post and say, 'Hey, anybody, I do Botox,' and not target people because it makes people not feel good."

Nick: Oh, you want to give her marketing advice?

Leah: Well, I want her to not do it again.

Nick: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I guess you have two paths. There's the just ignore it. Like, why dignify this? But that's not very satisfying. So then you have to decide, like, oh, is that good enough for you? Or do we want to let Lisa know that, like, this was a little out of bounds?

Leah: Like, I would run it right back. "Ouch!" But the funny thing is that I know in Lisa's mindóbecause she does this every dayóit's like, the most normal thing. So for her, saying someone should get Botox isn't ...

Nick: Offensive, I guess.

Leah: Yeah. In any way. But, like, she shouldn't be sayingóyou just don't say that to people.

Nick: What if you wrote back, "Wow!" Can you get that inflection on a post?

Leah: Is it a text? Because, you know, you can do it on a text. DM'd me. Okay. So I don't know if you can do it on the DM.

Nick: Yeah. How do you convey "Wow?"

Leah: I mean, I think if you wrote that, it wouldóit would be conveyed.

Nick: [laughs] Okay. Yeah, That's an idea. I guess you could be like, "Oh, thank you so much for thinking of me, but I'm good."

Leah: I think that's the most polite answer.

Nick: Yeah.

Leah: I think not answering, you're giving the clue.

Nick: No, I don't think Lisa's gonna pick up on that, because she's posting this under everybody's photo, so she's not gonna notice that you didn't respond to this one.

Leah: Mmm.

Nick: I guess the question is: is everybody else in this photo also getting this DM?

Leah: Well, she might not know the other people.

Nick: Mmm, okay. Fair enough.

Leah: It's just not appropriate.

Nick: Yeah. At the end of the day, we just don't comment on people's looks, and especially what's wrong with them, what you think is wrong, and what needs to be fixed. Like, there's just no polite way to do that. And I guess I appreciate there's a discount, but I don't think that takes the edge off.

Leah: It reminds me when you're walking down the streetóthis happened to me a lot in New Yorkóand people are fliering for, like, a multilevel-marketing diet product or diet program. And they flier you, and it feelsóyou're like, "Wow, I'm offended." But they're just fliering.

Nick: Yeah. Or weren't you inóI feel like you were in some Colorado ski town where some cosmetic person ...

Leah: Oh, yes Nick. Thank you for bringing this up.

Nick: Was sort of like, "Wow, you look haggard. You should get some of these products." [laughs]

Leah: Yes. I was in Vail. I'll call it out. I was in Vail, and I was walking by, and they were giving out free samples. And I said, "No, thank you." And the gentleman said, "Are you sure you don't want some for the under-eye area?"

Nick: [laughs] Yeah. So I feel like this is very similar to that. Yeah. So rude then, rude now.

Leah: I also think that peopleóand I don't want to do a malicious read of Lisa.

Nick: Yeah, that's true. Yeah, I think Lisa is not intending to, like, just be totally offensive here. She really thinks she's like, "I offered the service. Here's a discount. Everybody gets Botox."

Leah: But let us remember how much the world makes money offóparticularly womenófeeling insecure about themselves.

Nick: Mmm. That's a good point.

Leah: So when people can sort of just, like, sort of be like, "Oh, did you think that was okay about you?" Like, for me, when that guy was like, "Oh, those under-eyes." And then I would be like, "Oh, no! Please make my under-eyes acceptable to this random man in the doorway. Let me pay however much money it is that my under-eyes will be okay." I mean, that's how the world is making money off women. And so it is a thing that happens where people, like, neg people to get their money.

Nick: Yeah, I guess that's exactly what this is. Yes. Lisa is negging you to try to get you to do Botox.

Leah: And whether she realizes it or not, that, at its essence, is what is happening, and it's not appropriate.

Nick: Yeah. And it's rude.

Leah: It's rude!

Nick: So sorry, letter-writer.

Leah: I'm sorry, too.

Nick: So our next question is quote, "My wife and I are having a debate. She is an introvert, and finds social events draining. We're going to a baptism and luncheon. The invitation says that the baptism starts at 11:00 am, and there will be a luncheon at the church afterwards. The invitation does not say when the luncheon starts or ends. I offered to help by giving a ride home to some out-of-town relatives of the hosts. My wife is worried that we will be stuck there past 4:00 pm. I cannot imagine that a luncheon could be expected to last that long. And if people do want to stay, I certainly don't think it would be rude for us to let the out-of-town guests know that we need to head out with them by four o'clock. My wife wants me to ask the host to confirm that we can leave by four o'clock. I think the question is a bit rude, and I would rather simply make our goodbyes at four o'clock, and if the out-of-town guests feel strongly about staying longer, they can take a rideshare home Thoughts?"

Leah: I had two thoughts here.

Nick: Okay.

Leah: My first one is yes, I think it would be better to just be like, "Oh, we had to leave at 4:00."

Nick: Yeah?

Leah: Instead of saying in advance, "Hey, this ends by 4:00." Correct?

Nick: Yeah. I don't love asking, because it definitely feels like a little transactional. I don't know, doesn't feel right.

Leah: But I think there's no problem with saying at 4:00, "Oh, we had to go by 4:00." And to tell the relatives if they need to stay, they have to takeóif they want to leave by 4:00, we're happy to drive them, but otherwise they gotta take a rideshare. I think that's fine.

Nick: Yeah, I think that's fine to make the giving them a ride conditional on, like, when you need to leave to make sure that that's okay with them.

Leah: Yes.

Nick: I think that's a fair thing.

Leah: And then the other option I thought of was, if you are a household that has two cars ...

Nick: Mmm! Oh, isn't that an interesting approach?

Leah: I think that sometimes people feel like they have to go together, they have to stay the amount of time. But the individuals in the relationship are very different socially, and one person really wants to stay and the other person burns out very quickly. And I think a way to deal with that is two cars.

Nick: Yeah, that's actually a great point. Couples aren't obligated to leave at the same time, are they? No. There's no etiquette rule that says you have to do that.

Leah: I just think people don't do it because they were like, "Oh, that'só" but it's somehow not right. But I think it's actually fine.

Nick: Yeah. I think as long as you're not leaving before sort of the natural time, that's appropriate to leave.

Leah: Yeah.

Nick: So, like, we're not leaving the wedding during the speeches, for example. Like, you're at least staying until the cake is cut.

Leah: Yeah. And then you just slip out.

Nick: Right. And then if your partner wants to stay and dance and go to the afterparty, then great.

Leah: Yeah.

Nick: Yeah. My first thought was carriages. This would be a great invitation to put carriages on.

Leah: Yes, Nick!

Nick: Right? I thought, "Call back."

Nick: I also was thinking, like, I think you're gonna be out of there by four o'clock. I mean, a baptism is what, an hour? So that's like 11:00 to 12:00. Let's say there's, like, some milling and some photography, and now there's a luncheon. And okay, luncheons are formal but, like, two hours? Like, how many hours is this luncheon? Like, we're done by 4:00. I can't imagine!

Leah: I think you're actually gonna be done by 3:00.

Nick: Unless there's like an afterparty in Brooklyn in some warehouse. Or like an after-afterparty, you know?

Leah: Every time I go to church, there's always an afterparty in Brooklyn.

Nick: Right? I mean, that's just how it goes. And then I was thinking, because, like, my brain really went down a whole path with this question. Luncheon. The idea of a luncheon, it's like a formal lunch. But why don't we have a dinner-eon or a breakfast-eon or a cake-eon? I feel like we should be using this suffix on more things.

Leah: I feel like there's something happening over there. And you've really taken this question ...

Nick: [laughs]

Leah: Because I think for those other things we have other phrases.

Nick: If I was gonna have a formal cake party, we don't have a word for that.

Leah: Well, you would call it a "cake party."

Nick: But how do we know it's formal? It's a cake-eon.

Leah: I mean, Nick, honestly, you could start it.

Nick: Yeah. No, I think ...

Leah: But also, who wouldn't want that? Did you see in the news that person who brought, like, lots of cakes to the park, and told people they could bring a cake? And they thought it would be, like, 15 people and then, like, 75 people brought cakes?

Nick: [laughs] That's a lot of cake. Oh, I missed that story.

Leah: That's what you could call it, "the cake-eon."

Nick: The cake-eon. Yeah. And it'd be like a luncheon, but for cake. So I think anytime something is more formal, I think we just add that suffix. I guess E-O-N?

Leah: E-O-N. It's gotta be an E-O-N.

Nick: Yeah, it has to be E-O-N. So ice-cream-eon. Cake-eon. Do we pronounce it "eon" or "on?" Because it's not "lunch-eon."

Leah: I think it would be "cake-on?"

Nick: Right?

Leah: But then it sounds like a verb. I'm caking it on my face.

Nick: I mean, I'm not mad at that.

Leah: I mean, I'm not not.

Nick: [laughs] So okay, that aside. Yeah, so we wouldn't ask when it ends. I think we just let the people we're giving rides to know, like, what your kind of idea, expectations, plans are. Make sure that works for them. And then if this baptism-luncheon thing goes past four o'clock, a five-hour event, then please let us know. I mean, let us know if this is what has happened. And if this is what has happened, how did we fill the time? How did we fill the time?

Leah: I'm hedging my bets it's three o'clock.

Nick: Now one thing just to throw in the mix that I just thought of is if this is in someone's private home and not at, like, the church or, like, some place, then there is a world in which a party that happens at a home just, like, never ends. Like, there's like no natural stopping point, it's just people hanging out until people get exhausted. And so I could see a world in which it might just sort of like keep going, but you would still be welcome to leave at a certain point. Whereas if this is in some, like, actual, like, event venue, yeah, under no circumstances this is going past four o'clock.

Leah: Yeah. And they're saying it's at the church.

Nick: I mean, the baptism is.

Leah: And then there will be a luncheon at the church.

Nick: At the church. Oh. Well then, yeah. Asked and answered. Yeah. Oh no, you're good. Yeah. You don't have to set your TiVo for anything. Yeah, you'll be home.

Leah: Do people even have TiVos anymore?

Nick: [laughs] No. No, I said it because that's funny! Yeah. Use your VCR-plus, everybody.

Leah: I do have a VCR, so ...

Nick: Okay. I mean, does it have the VCR-plus technology?

Leah: It has a VCR DVD player, which thank goodness, since I was recently gifted ...

Nick: Oh, yes. I sent Leah a bunch of DVDs for her birthday, which are all holiday themed.

Leah: They were lovely, and I'm so excited.

Nick: Who knew there were so many Christmas movies that involved puppies?

Leah: I knew. [laughs]

Nick: Leah knew. So our next question is quote, "My husband is in hospital, and someone from his church wanted to visit him while I was visiting him. She started taking photos of me and my husband while he's laid up there with tubes and him and all. I told her to stop immediately, and asked her what she was gonna do with the photos. Her response was quote, 'Share it with a friend.' Why? I said, 'No, no, no, no, no.' And then I asked my husband right in front of her whether he wanted to guard his own privacy and he said yes, no pictures. I can't understand why people take pictures of others in hospital. What is this about?"

Leah: A) I hope everybody's home and doing well.

Nick: Yes, for sure.

Leah: Also, is this person British?

Nick: I mean, they're definitely not American. Because we're saying "in hospital."

Leah: Which I love that. I love that from all of the television shows I watch.

Nick: So I guess I mean, that's definitely British. I think that's Australian. I don't know if that's Canadian. I don't know what the Canadians do.

Leah: I don't think it's Canadian.

Nick: So yeah, let's assume this is British. But I think the etiquette is universal.

Leah: Oh, the etiquette is universal. I just wanted to say I've tried to work that into my language.

Nick: Oh, "hospital?" Okay.

Leah: Yeah. "In a hospital."

Nick: Mm-hmm. "Going to hospital."

Leah: But yes, so rude. I don't like this at all.

Nick: I mean, I don't think this is even rude. It's like, this is beyond etiquette. This is not even an etiquette question. Like, you're taking pictures of somebody at a hospital. Like, what?

Leah: What?

Nick: So what is this about?

Leah: It is a part of our world where people just take photos of everything. And you're like, "What are you doing right now?"

Nick: Yeah, I guess that's it, that we just want to document everything. We feel like everything should be documented.

Leah: And you're, like, laying in a hospital bed and someone comes in, they start taking photos. "Hey, I'm gonna send this to a friend." Are you? No, I don't think so.

Nick: And send to a friend for what? Like, what is the caption on this photo? Is it a mutual friend, at least?

Leah: Are you gonna throw up the peace sign? Like, what's going on?

Nick: Yeah, I just don't know what we're doing with that. Yeah. Like, sharing is not always caring.

Leah: But I love that our letter-writer stopped it immediately and was like, "Don't do that."

Nick: Yeah, I think that was fair. I mean, I feel like we didn't need to loop in the husband and patient being like, "Hey, just to make sure I'm not overstepping, you don't want photos, right?" Like, I don't think that was necessary.

Leah: Oh, I thought that was nice.

Nick: Very nice. I mean, it's good to have backup. But yeah, I mean ...

Leah: Well, she was just double checking to be like, well, maybe he wants to do selfies in a hospital. I shouldn't ...

Nick: Yeah, I shouldn't speak for him. Sure.

Leah: And then he's like, "Yep. No. No."

Nick: No. Yeah, I mean, who wants that?

Leah: Who wants this?

Nick: Like, this is the most vulnerable anybody is.

Leah: Yeah. People don't want photos when they're vulnerable. Like, stop!

Nick: Yeah, so don't do that.

Leah: Don't do it.

Nick: And I guess, like, if this did sort of escalate, I would loop in a nurse or somebody from the hospital, and be like, "Hey, can you jump in here?" Because I mean, I'm sure the hospital has some policy against photographing patients.

Leah: I mean, I can't imagine it escalating. Imagine you say, "Don't do that," and someone just keeps taking pictures of you?

Nick: I mean, that would be wild.

Leah: They would beóyou would have to take their phone and delete the photos.

Nick: You would need toóyes.

Leah: And then also always remember to delete them from the recently-deleted file as well.

Nick: Ah, yeah. And the cloud, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah. Pro tip.

Leah: Mmm!

Nick: Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry this happened. But yeah, you didn't do anything wrong. Although I guess that wasn't your question. You know that was wrong, you're just like, "Why are they doing it?" And yeah, I guess the explanation is just like, people have no sense of decency.

Leah: Weóthe answer is we are broken.

Nick: We are broken as a society. And this is yet another example.

Leah: I think there's so many people on the socials, like, showing, like, these very vulnerable moments. And then people are like, "I'm gonna show other people's vulnerable moments." And you're like, "No. No, you're not."

Nick: Yeah, I guess it's one thing to show your own. Like, if you want to be in the hospital and you want to livestream the experience then, like, have at it, if that's what your audience wants. But, like, to do it with other people without their permission? That's just, like, such a leap.

Leah: Yeah, it's such a leap. "I'm just gonna send this to a few friends."

Nick: "Surely you don't mind."

Leah: "Surely!" I love that they don't even ask, because they think it's so normal to just bust into a hospital room and start doing a photo shoot.

Nick: Yeah. They're like, "Why? Why don't you want me doing this?" "Oh, I don't know. Because decency?"

Leah: Mmm!

Nick: So our next question is quote, "I have a dilemma. I have a lovely collection of personalized stationery, but I've just been divorced and my name changed. Is it terribly gauche to keep using my stationery? Maybe I just write to close friends and the surname slash can have a double meaning?"

Leah: I did a good giggle on that.

Nick: So if you don't remember, in a previous episode we have talked about slashing your name on personal stationery, which is a signal that who you're writing to, you feel a more intimate personal connection to, that this is less formal.

Leah: And then so this one would be a double entendre.

Nick: Which is fun. I mean, I do like that, because etiquette is like poetry. You are allowed to break the rules once you know them. So if you know the rule that you probably shouldn't be having stationery that's not your current name, and you know the rule about slashes, and you are only writing to personal friends, and you're doing all of this with intention, then yeah, I think on some level this is fine.

Leah: I think also our letter-writer is not just doing it with intention, she's also doing it with whimsy.

Nick: Yeah, there's like a wink. There's a wink.

Leah: You could also just write parentheticals, "Not no more."

Nick: Yeah. I mean, you could have fun with it. That said, I don't love using this stationery. I mean, I think let's just, like, get new stationery.

Leah: But they love their lovely collection of personalized stationery.

Nick: Well, so I actuallyóI know the stationery brand that is in question. I emailed the CEO of this brand, and ...

Leah: Wait, how do you know the stationary brand?

Nick: I know every stationary brand. You think I don't know a stationary brand?

Leah: Yeah, but I mean, how do you know?

Nick: I asked.

Leah: Oh, okay.

Nick: Oh, yeah. No, I know. I know a brand we're talking about specifically for this. [laughs]

Leah: I was like, is Nick, like, he vibes stationary?

Nick: Stationary whisperer?

Leah: Yes.

Nick: No, I know what brand was involved. And I emailed the CEO and I was like, "FYI, this thing happened. Like, what can we do?" And so there actually is, like, this very exclusive online-only deal that they're offering right now. And so, like, I let our letter-writer know, like, hey, you could get new stationery. I would encourage that, because, like, that would be the better thing to do. And you might be like, oh, my gosh, stationery is so expensive and I want to be practical. But have you actually been in a Target recently? I was just in Target and I was, like, standing near the card rack and I was like, "Let me just see how much these are priced." $4.99 plus tax. $4.99 for one flimsy little card. And I thought that is highway robbery, because my personalized hand-engraved stationery is way less than that per card. So ...

Leah: Yeah, and $4.99 is actually not even the high end of cards. There's, like, ones in there that are like $6.95.

Nick: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, I saw $8.99. Had some glitter, which I thought, like, "Oh, you couldn't pay me to buy the glitter card." But I digress. So it actually is a good value to have your own stationery. Like, it's just cheaper than buying cards. It just is. And so I think you should just get new stationery.

Leah: I do love this about you, Nick, that you reached out to the company. You figured it out.

Nick: Yeah, we're very service-y here.

Leah: It's one of Nick'sóone of Nick's many amazing qualities.

Nick: Yeah. So yeah, we're happy to help. So yes, I think you can use it as long as you are using it with intention. But I think generally speaking, we want our stationary to reflect who we are today. And so I think it's important to have stationary that does that. Because it's very personal. I mean, it is personalized stationary. The whole point is that it is only yours; no one else has this. And so I think if you do not feel like this person anymoreóand you are not, because you are notóthen, like, you should have new stationary.

Leah: And I just want to say as a caveat, I know some people keep their name because they developed a business persona.

Nick: In which case that's fine.

Leah: Yeah, in which case, obviously. But that's not the question.

Nick: Yeah. No, I mean, if you still go by that name, then yeah, there's no question here. Like, it's fine, because that is your current name and that's your stationary. Although I guess after a divorce, like, sometimes people get, like, a dramatic haircut. So maybe, like, getting totally different personalized stationery, that could be another thing that people can do. Like a new me sort of thing.

Leah: New me, new cards.

Nick: Right? Yeah. New me, new font.

Leah: New me, new font.

Nick: [laughs] Right? Out with serifs. I'm a sans serif now.

Leah: Oh! Wow.

Nick: Wow. So our next question is quote, "I have a 10-plus-year-old etiquette dilemma that still puzzles me sometimes, and I'd love your opinion. In high school, I used to go on summer service trips with my church. Usually, we'd stay at the high school in the community we were working in. There would usually be about two other church groups there, too. Each work crew was assigned chores around the living areas, like sweeping the dining area or taking out the trash. One year there was a group of girls who were assigned shower cleanup. They would clean the shower as instructed, then take their own showers for the day. Some other students found this appalling. Was it because it was like they were taking the cleanest shower for themselves, or instantly sullying the showers for everyone else? It's unclear. I thought this was fine, because cleaning a shower that 50 people have been using could make them feel a little dirty and want to shower. And it's not as if their one shower returned the shower to its previous dirty state. But is it wrong to clean something and then immediately use it for yourself, especially if it's a communal resource?"

Leah: I was looking forward to your opinion on this one, Nick.

Nick: Yeah. This is interesting, right?

Leah: It's interesting because I, like our letter-writer, would not be bothered in any way. It's not like it restores it to full dirtiness. And after you do clean something, you often do want to shower because you're covered in bleach.

Nick: Yeah. So I guess the question is why do some people find this appalling? Appalling! I mean, what a word!

Leah: What a word. I do think it's that they think, "Oh, you just cleaned it for everybody else, but then you used it first. You should let other people use it first."

Nick: Yeah. I mean, I guess it has the flavor of, like, oh, you're taking the best part of this thing for yourself.

Leah: I was trying to think about, like, what other people's chores are, because I've been on these where it's like groups and there's multiple groups there. And like usually there's somebody in kitchen, you know what I mean? But, like, say I had taking out the trash duty.

Nick: Right.

Leah: And then I took out all the trash bags, and then I put clean bags into all the places and then I threw something into the trash bag first. I would not care.

Nick: No. But, like, you don't care if there's trash in the trash already, whereas, like, in a shower, like, oh, do I care how many people have used the shower before I just got in there?

Leah: Well, regardless, you should be using shower shoes.

Nick: Actually, that was my thought. It's like, why are we not using shower shoes? Like, that should be mandatory. Like, this question should not matter.

Leah: Welcome planter's warts.

Nick: I mean, that's the least of your problems.

Leah: Have you ever had a planter's wart? It's not at the leastóit takes a long time.

Nick: Okay. I mean, I think there's a lot of things that you can get in a communal shower with 50 people. Let's just put it that way.

Leah: [laughs]

Nick: But I guess, is it like, "Oh, I just baked a cake, and then I'm taking the best?" No, what's a food where, like, there's a good part? Like, there's an obviously best part of it? Is it like, "Oh, I'm making artichoke hearts for everybody and then I'm eating the heart?" Is that what it is?

Leah: I was thinking of baking as, like, lunch. Like, I baked the lunch. If I baked the lunch, I wouldn't serve myself first.

Nick: Right. I guess it's a little of that. Or like ...

Leah: The thing is is that with foods, like, somebody could want one part of it and I would want another part. So that's a harder call.

Nick: That's true. Yeah.

Leah: But I do think it's like serving yourself first. It would be like taking the first piece of cake.

Nick: Right. Yeah. And somehow it was the best piece of cake. Or is, like, the cake that had, like, the best chocolate sprinkle section. Or I don't know, but I guess that would be the equivalent somehow?

Leah: But I mean, I personally wouldn'tóI understand, like, people just scrub showers, and they're covered in cleaning products and, like, all this stuff, and they want to rinse off.

Nick: Yeah. I mean, I guess the way to do it would be if we've all cleaned the shower, we, of course, wanna shower ourselves now. But instead of maybe using all 10 shower stalls we just cleaned, maybe we all, as the cleaning crew, decide to use just one stall so that the other nine are still pristine?

Leah: What if you're cleaning them, and then there's people waiting to shower?

Nick: Okay?

Leah: Would we let the people that were waiting shower first and then we shower?

Nick: Oh, how does the queue work? So we've cleaned it, now we're done. People are waiting to shower. Uh ...

Leah: Because in my mind, there was nobody waiting. We just cleaned, and then we showered and then we went about our business.

Nick: Although honestly, I feel like when we're talking about all the chores, the shower duty is way worse than the taking-out-the-trash duty.

Leah: It literally is way worse.

Nick: And so I feel like, give them a perk.

Leah: Anybody that has to clean a bathroom, it's the worst job.

Nick: It's like the people on an airplane in the middle seat. You get the armrests. It's the least we can do for you.

Leah: I agree with this.

Nick: Right? So I feel like yeah, just buck up, people. Let the shower people shower.

Leah: Let the shower people shower.

Nick: Yeah. So yeah, is it wrong to clean something and then immediately use it for yourself? No, it's not.

Leah: I think we're gonna get some people disagreeing with us.

Nick: Then bring it. [laughs]

Leah: But I feel very comfortable withóI feel comfortable with this answer. Unless the people showering are, like, filthy and they, like, spit on the floor, and then they, like, drop all their stuff and then leave it. And then, I mean, then that's no.

Nick: Yeah. I mean, if you using it makes a mess for everybody else who's next, then yes, you have not actually cleaned the shower, then. The idea is that you've cleaned the showers and it is in a clean state for everybody else. And so yeah, I think your one shower is not gonna make it dirty, necessarily.

Leah: I don't think so either. And if you're that dirty, then maybe do a little rinse afterwards.

Nick: Yeah. Yeah, let's hose it down a little bit. And I would bet that the people who clean the showers, after they showered, I bet they made sure that, like, they got the walls down a little bit.

Leah: I bet they do, yeah.

Nick: Got the soap scum off. Right.

Leah: I think so, too.

Nick: Right? But I love that this has haunted you for more than a decade.

Leah: Well, it's a great question, because I mean, when does that come up?

Nick: When does that come up? Right. Yeah, when else does this come up in our lives?

Leah: When do we ever discuss what's appropriate for something like this?

Nick: Yeah. Well, you heard it here first.

Leah: Here it is. This is what we're here for.

Nick: That's what we're here for. So you out there, we're here for you. And so let us know, are there any questions that have been haunting you for over a decade? Let us help. And of course, we'll take your more recent questions, vents, repents, and everything else. Send it to us through our website, WereYouRaisedByWolves.com. Or you can leave us a voicemail or send us a text message: (267) CALL-RBW. And we'll see you next time.

Leah: Bye!

Nick: Bye!