Abandoning Dinner Guests, Running Into Former Students, Singing Happy Birthday, and More

Nick: Hey everybody, it's Nick Leighton.

Leah: And it's Leah Bonnema.

Nick: And we had so many great questions from you all in the wilderness ...

Leah: [howls]

Nick: ... that we have a bonus episode. So here we go. Our first question is quote, "What would be your reaction to this? You are visiting a friend and she invites you to stay for dinner. She sets you and your kids up in the kitchen with food and everything, then retires to the dining room to eat with her family. This is in another room with a closed door between her and you."

Leah: Since the opening statement is, "What would your reaction be to this?" I wrote, "I'd pass out."

Nick: [laughs] I wrote, "Whoa."

Leah: [laughs]

Nick: "Whoa."

Leah: Wait, what?

Nick: Whoa. Yeah, so you're giving me food. Okay. Good. I like that.

Leah: Well, you've invited me.

Nick: Yeah, you've asked me to stay for dinner. And so you have done that. True.

Leah: But then you're putting me and my family in a room, closing a door and then going to another room to eat.

Nick: Do you think the menu is the same?

Leah: I—I—no.

Nick: Yeah, is this like first class and coach?

Leah: I don't know what's going on.

Nick: [laughs] Like, "Oh, here's some Biscoff cookies."

Leah: What's happening?

Nick: What is happening? Yeah, I mean ...

Leah: And also with no explanation to be like, "Oh, we have a small table."

Nick: Sure, that would not be a good explanation, but I would take it.

Leah: No, but I mean, just like, something that ...

Nick: Yeah, like, "Our dining room is too small."

Leah: I just—what? What?

Nick: It's very—yeah, I guess, I mean, I was trying to think, like, what is the benefit of the doubt here? Other than just, like, oh, you're just, like, so rude. I guess maybe we just have a very rigid household routine. And so, like, I wanted you to stay for dinner, so I extended that invitation, but our household routine is so rigid that it's very important that us as a family sit together and do this thing, and you can't be a part of that. That's not part of our routine. Is that a thing?

Leah: Well, even if it's a thing, it's still very off putting without some sort of explanation. And even then, I would be like, "Hey, we're doing this thing where we eat in a certain way at a certain time, and we have to have family time and it's the thing we all committed to. So if you need to stay—and, like, thank you for coming. If you want to stay and eat before you hit the road, I can set food up for you in the kitchen.

Nick: Okay. Yes, I would be more on board with that. I would think it was odd that we can't make an exception tonight but, like, okay. Okay, I respect your family tradition.

Leah: You know what I mean? That would be a whole other conversation than just being like, "Oh, I'm setting it up, and now I'm shutting the door, and now I'm going in the other room."

Nick: [laughs] The shutting the door feels like dialing it up a notch.

Leah: It does, it's like we can't even yell through to each other?

Nick: Yeah, "I don't want to see you eat in the kitchen with your children."

Leah: "I don't wanna hear it, I don't wanna see it."

Nick: I was trying to think, like, maybe there's a cultural explanation, and I was trying—kind of thinking through my database, like, is there a culture that does this with hospitality? Because so often hospitality around the world is actually about being overly gracious and generous to your guests. It's like the total opposite of this. Like, I can't really think of a culture that would do this to a guest. And the closest I could come up with is that—did you hear about this a couple of years ago? It was called Swedengate, #Swedengate. And there is—or was, I don't think it really comes up anymore, but there was a thing in Sweden where, let's say we were like school chums, and you came over to my house to play after school. And so we're playing, and then my parents were like, "Oh, dinner." And so what would happen is I would go downstairs to, like, eat dinner, and we would leave you in my bedroom to play. You would not join for my family's dinner. And so this kind of blew up on the internet because it's sort of like, oh, that is sort of unusual, I think, if you're not Swedish. And the Swedish explanation for this is like, oh, like, we assume that you have your own hot dinner at home to go to. And so, like, unless we made arrangements with your family, like, we wouldn't want to spoil your dinner. And so, like, you're gonna go home soon so, like, you'll have dinner with your family.

Nick: And there's also kind of a Swedish thing about not necessarily wanting to be indebted to other people. And so, like, there's a little of that flavor happening. And also just Swedish children are like raised to be a little more independent, so the idea of, like, being left alone to play for half an hour is, like, not traumatic in any way. And so this did blow up the internet. which is like, oh, I'm in your house, but you're eating without me? So maybe it's that?

Leah: But the thing is is that we are eating. We all are eating.

Nick: We are all eating. I know. I was really going deep into the wells of my etiquette knowledge with this.

Leah: And I was invited to eat.

Nick: I was also asked to stay for dinner. That's true. And I was given dinner. I was given dinner.

Leah: You were given dinner.

Nick: So yes, "Please stay for dinner. It's just not dinner with us. It's dinner at our house, just not with us." Yeah. So what would our reaction be? Cautious in the future?

Leah: My reaction would just be absolute confusion.

Nick: I think the opportunity to jump on this was while it was happening. Like, "Oh, do you want us to join you in the dining room?" Question mark.

Leah: I mean, I think our answer—we have our answer when she closed the door on us and walked away.

Nick: I would've definitely taken a glass up to the door to listen.

Leah: [laughs] I think I probably, in the moment, would've just sort of been like, shock and awe.

Nick: I would definitely have been shocked. Yeah, I actually—I would have froze. I would not have known what to do. If you're like, "Oh, here's your food," and then it's sort of like, "Bye." Door slam.

Leah: "Thanks for dinner."

Nick: Yeah, I mean, I guess on the way out, like, I guess let's say we finish first, would we pop into the dining room to say goodbye?

Leah: That's the thing. You're like, am I allowed out again?

Nick: It's very weird. So, okay.

Leah: Maybe someone in our audience can come up with some sort of a story to make it make sense, but ...

Nick: Yeah, make it make sense for us.

Leah: Because, like, the only thing would be if, like, I wanted to feed you before you left, but I wasn't eating yet. But then I would still stay in the room. I would set the table for you and stay in the room to talk.

Nick: No, the idea that I'm eating my meal in a separate room from you? No, it's—no, there is no world. There's just no world.

Leah: I don't get it.

Nick: Listeners, if you have an explanation, Let us know.

Leah: Hit us with it.

Nick: Let us know what are we missing. Maybe this is like one of those other questions where, like, we just totally missed something obvious. Have we missed something here? What have we missed? What is the reasonable explanation for why we would do this?

Leah: I mean, I'm gonna be shocked if we missed something obvious, but I'm really excited to hear what are possible options.

Nick: Like, maybe are there ghosts? Is it ghosts?

Leah: I hope those are the things that people write in.

Nick: So our next question is quote, "My friend and I both live in small towns several hours away from each other, and she turned me onto a Zoom exercise class taught by a friend of hers from her hometown. The classes are great, however, it interferes with my dog walking time on weekday mornings. I've been attending these classes even though I sometimes have to log in a little bit late because of my dog walks. As I was looking through the exercise website, which is very nicely done and easy to navigate, I noticed that there was a Saturday class listed. 'That would be so great,' I said to myself. When I tried to sign up for that Saturday class, I was unable to, so I emailed the teacher and I asked her if I was signing up too late for this month. She replied and she said simply, 'I don't teach a Saturday class.' I refreshed the website, logged out of my computer, logged back in and went back to the site and there is clearly listed a Saturday class. So I took a screenshot of the class, and I emailed her again, including the screenshot, and I said, 'Just to be clear, is this class no longer offered?' I got an email back from her that said, 'Just to be clear, I don't teach a Saturday class.' I was so surprised at the snippy tone of her email. I know it's easy to misinterpret texts and emails because you can't hear the tone of voice or inflection, but because this is her business, I expected something more like, 'Yes, I used to teach a Saturday morning class, but I no longer teach that class.' Or 'Thanks for asking,' or something. So my question is: Do I explain to my friend why I won't be taking the exercise class with her on Zoom anymore? Or do I make up an excuse for not taking it because I don't want to hurt her feelings and make her feel differently about her friend, the exercise teacher?"

Leah: I kind of feel like this episode we have a few of these questions that really feel uncomfortable.

Nick: Yeah, welcome to etiquette sometimes.

Leah: I mean, we just put bangers right in a row.

Nick: Yeah. So this was precise, but it wasn't polite. I think that's kind of my first thought.

Leah: The Zoom exercise teacher?

Nick: Yeah. Yeah, it's true, there's not a Saturday class. Sure.

Leah: No, it's the reiteration of, "Just to be clear."

Nick: Yeah.

Leah: That's what it is.

Nick: Yeah, I don't love that. Although I do think our letter-writer did have some opportunities to do things differently here. And so I do want to address that.

Leah: Go on. I actually thought that you would.

Nick: Yeah. So two things. I think there is something very provocative about sending a screenshot. I think that can be read as very aggressive because that's basically like, "I've got receipts and I'm proving it. And here's the proof." And that can come across as a little strong.

Leah: So your suggestion would be like, "Oh, I got confused. Oh, you have a Saturday class listed on your website."

Nick: I think that would have been a little softer and nicer than "Here is proof that you're wrong." Because I think that is how it was received. Even if that wasn't your intent, I think that's how this was received.

Leah: Which I do not think was our letter-writer's intent at all.

Nick: Definitely was not the intent. No, no, no, no, no. And I think there is a generational thing, which I think younger people are more used to screenshots and sending receipts and, like, "Oh, you said this in text, here's where you said it. Here's the shot of our text exchange where we had that conversation." I think it's a little more normalized for some generations just to do that. I think it's not across the board, though. And so I think maybe that's a little bit of a disconnect how we interpret the use of screenshots.

Leah: And then so moving forward, would you tell the friend that you're just not taking the class, or ...?

Nick: Well, before we get there, then I think the phrasing, "just to be clear," that is also a little aggressive. I think that can come across the wrong way, too. And that's why that got thrown back in your face because you sent a screenshot, you kind of use this phrase that can maybe sound a little harsh. And this teacher got this and was like, "What is—what is this?" And she's like, "Just to be clear, I don't teach on Saturdays." Now you are absolutely correct. As a business person, she should have been like, "Let me check my website to see if it's wrong." And the response should have been, "Oh my goodness, my website has not been updated. Didn't realize it was there. Yes, I no longer offer a Saturday class," or "I never offered a Saturday class," or "Unfortunately Saturday is not available. So sorry for any confusion, but hope to see you next Tuesday."

Leah: Yeah, because this person, our letter-writer, is a client.

Nick: Right. So even if a client was being a little rude or you thought they were being a little rude, you should just sort of take it on the chin. But I do think the screenshot combined with this "just to be clear" phrasing, I think that probably set this person off, which is why their response was what it was.

Leah: I guess the goal would be—because, you know, I always want to support the letter-writer.

Nick: Absolutely, yeah. And I—you know, I hate ever criticizing our letter-writers. And so I say all that with love. And I know you had the best intentions, and I think I'm just explaining what the teacher of this class may have interpreted your actions as.

Leah: I think the teacher of the class could definitely have interpreted those actions that way.

Nick: Yes.

Leah: Knowing our letter-writer, I know that that was not the intention.

Nick: Of course. Because they're one of our letter-writers, and so inherently you are by default a nice, polite person.

Leah: They were just trying to figure out what was happening. The dream would be if I emailed you and was like, "Hey, trying to log in for this Saturday class." The dream would be, you know, I'm trying to give you business and log in on a Saturday. And I've emailed you and then you just email me back, "I don't teach a Saturday class."

Nick: Right.

Leah: And so I feel like the reason our letter-writer had sent a follow up is because she had already tried to be like, "I'm trying to log into this Saturday class." So she's essentially trying to give business, trying to make this work.

Nick: Right. I see. Yes.

Leah: And that person just wrote back with a "I don't teach a Saturday class." That sort of could have been a little bit of a longer response.

Nick: Yeah. Okay, that's a good point. She started it.

Leah: She started it with—by you being like, "I'm trying to pay for your classes."

Nick: And she was like, "Nope."

Leah: And she's like, "I don't teach."

Nick: "There is no Saturday class."

Leah: Yes.

Nick: Okay. No, that's true. Yeah, she started it. Like, her tone—yeah. No, she did start it because that was not the response.

Leah: That's not the response.

Nick: No, the response was like, "Oh, so sorry. I don't teach a Saturday class." Although I guess she probably didn't realize that it's on her website. But the email should have been, "Hey, so nice to hear from you. It's great to have you in class. Unfortunately, I don't teach Saturdays right now. See you at the next class. Bye!" That would have been nice.

Leah: Like a full thought.

Nick: A fuller thought rather than, "No, Saturday does not exist." Send.

Leah: Yeah.

Nick: Right. Yeah, I do see why our letter-writer had to push back and be like, "Yeah, but it's on your website." But I think just saying, like, "Hey, but I think I saw it on your website," would have been the move. I think going right to receipts? Yeah, I think maybe too far.

Leah: I don't disagree with you.

Nick: But ...

Leah: No buts. I don't disagree. I just want our letter-writer to feel loved.

Nick: Yes. No, we love our letter-writers. So okay, what do we do? Do we lie to our friend or not?

Leah: [laughs]

Nick: Do we lie or not?

Leah: I don't want to lie.

Nick: No.

Leah: So it's whether or not we tell them or do we just leave?

Nick: Well, and I guess, is this exercise-ending event? Are we just done with this person?

Leah: Yeah, they're not gonna go to the class anymore.

Nick: We're done. Yeah, then I think the response to the friend is just, "Hey, the weekday schedule is just a little tough with my dog-walking schedule. So I don't think I'm gonna be able to keep it up."

Leah: So you think that we shouldn't tell them?

Nick: Well, I guess what would be the benefit of passing that along? Because, like, our friend is friends with this teacher. So if it would be important for the teacher to know why you're no longer attending, if you think that would be good feedback, I would just say that to the teacher directly. Like, "I was a little bothered by this exchange, so I don't think this is a great fit moving forward. But, you know, thank you for the great classes, you know, in the past." Like, if you felt that it was important for this teacher to have this feedback, then I would give it directly to the teacher and not involve my friend.

Leah: No, the only reason we would involve a friend, not because we want the teacher to have the feedback, but because we want our friend to have the information because we feel like we're lying.

Nick: Okay, then if we wanted to, I think you could say, like, "Hey, I had kind of an awkward email exchange with the teacher, which kind of left me a little like, meh." And also combine that with, like, "The weekday schedule is not really great for me. So I don't think I'm gonna be continuing, but ..."

Leah: And then I would say, "But, you know, thank you for inviting me. I've had fun."

Nick: Yeah. And maybe leave it at that. But—and I don't think we have to go to the details. I think we could just be like, "Oh, had kind of an awkward exchange, which left me a little meh."

Leah: Yeah, I think that sounds fair.

Nick: Yeah. So do that.

Leah: [laughs]

Nick: So our next question is ...

Leah: I want you guys to know that when Nick and I are talking about, like, things in my life or I'm saying something, he'll go—he says that to me too. "So do that."

Nick: Yep, do that. And then I change the subject.

Leah: And then he changes the subject. So this is— this is the most Nick.

Nick: [laughs] Peak Nick. So our next question is quote, "I've been a middle school teacher for long enough that I run into former students all the time. I deliberately do not live where I teach, but I've been at this for a long time and I teach about 500 students a year, so the run-ins are inevitable. Sometimes when I see them out in the wild, I'm not sure if I should greet them or not. First of all, they no longer look the same. I always run through every possible humiliating outcome as we glance at each other wondering, 'Do I know you?' On top of that, if they don't remember me or hated me when I taught them, then I've just interrupted their otherwise delightful outing. Is it rude to just ignore them and let them go about their day?"

Leah: Feel it. I recently confused these two men who have very similar faces—comics. One of them cut their hair.

Nick: Okay.

Leah: They both had very long hair. And one of them got— "Oh, your hair grew back so fast." I think I said that. Just something just absolutely insane. And then he was like, "No?" [laughs]

Nick: Okay, how did you recover from that?

Leah: I didn't recover. I didn't recover because I didn't get it until I got home. And I was like, oh, you mixed him up with his other very similar—and then I was like, okay. I just went, oh, you know, I just go, oh, and then I just moved on to something else.

Nick: Meanwhile, he's thinking, like, "What was Leah Bonnema saying about my hair?"

Leah: They're probably like, "She's involved in dog stuff. She's not paying attention." I don't know. I just, you know ...

Nick: It happens.

Leah: It happens is what I'm saying. And then I think I did something like, "Oh, who knows what I'm thinking?" You know what I mean? I just threw it back. Yeah! And I just say, "We have gorgeous hair." And then I just moved on. You know what I mean?

Nick: Okay. None of this is helpful for our letter-writer.

Leah: No, but I just want to say, I just acknowledge that, like, obviously I'm off and they're wonderful and I move forward. But I think I'll see people in public that I don't know. And then obviously our letter-writer doesn't really want to talk to these people.

Nick: I'm not getting that sense.

Leah: I'm not getting that sense. In which case, I think do we just plaster a smile on our face in case they're looking and we're looking. And then it's like, I'm—I'm greeting you, and if you had wanted to say hi, you could, but I'm just gonna keep moving forward.

Nick: Yeah. Okay. Well, I think there's actually three scenarios here. So that scenario is when I sort of recognize you and you sort of recognize me, and neither of us are very sure, I would do a smile.

Leah: Yes.

Nick: And so, like, smile, eye contact, and then I would leave it on you to decide what happens next. Otherwise, that's just what's happening. Then the second option is you recognize them, but they don't recognize you. And I think for that, I think we do nothing because you have made it very clear you are not interested in engaging any of your former students. So I think you just could kind of ignore it then if they don't really recognize you. You can be anonymous. And then the third option is they recognize you and you don't recognize them, and they come up to you and engage you. And then for that, you're like, "Oh my goodness! It's been so long. How are you? Remind me your name." And then I think we do do that.

Leah: Yeah, I don't even know if we need to say—I mean, if you were a student of a teacher that has 500 kids a year, I wouldn't expect—I would just reintroduce myself. "I'm Leah. You had me in—" you know?

Nick: Oh, that would be the correct thing if I'm interrupting you in the supermarket, yes. But a lot of people don't think to do that. So then I guess it's on you as the teacher if you want to even bother asking their name. Because you could decide to not.

Leah: Yeah, because you—sometimes you can get context clues. You could be like, "Oh, how are you doing?" You're like, "Well, you remember I always loved creative writing class." And then you're like, "Oh, it's Sean."

Nick: Over a 20-year teaching career, you're gonna have 10,000 students to keep track of? You're gonna need a lot more than context clues.

Leah: Yeah, but you know that you have some people that just stand out.

Nick: That's true.

Leah: You have a special bond.

Nick: Some people stand out, yeah.

Leah: I love how I said it in a nice way, but with your eye flicker you were like, "Yeah, some people have been real messes." [laughs]

Nick: [laughs] So our next question is quote ...

Leah: Wait, really quick, I wanna add on the last one. I think our letter-writer's just on their personal time. They don't actively not want to talk to people, they're just like, "I'm doing my own thing. Let's—I don't wanna have a complicated back and forth." I don't think they are disliking their students.

Nick: No, I don't think they're hostile.

Leah: No, but you said—you were like, "You made it clear that you do not ever want to speak to them again."

Nick: I mean, I'm getting a little of that flavor. I'm getting a little—maybe I'm reading between the lines.

Leah: They're on their personal time, and ...

Nick: Right.

Leah: Which we all understand.

Nick: Yeah. And also it's sort of like, yeah, we're all out and about, we're all doing our own thing, and so, like, do I want to interrupt your day?

Leah: Yeah.

Nick: So I think our letter-writer is conscientious about the quality of your day, and especially if you didn't like me, I guess.

Leah: And also the quality of your day, our letter-writer. You want to be able to have your day.

Nick: Yes, everybody wants a good day. So our next question is quote, "We've got a lovely neighbor who is cooking food for my husband and myself with increasing frequency. She'll phone to ask if I'm home, then tell me she's cooked for us and will either drop food off or I'll go and get it. The food is delicious, but it feels overly generous on her part, and I can't think of a way to reciprocate. We often give her lemons and limes from our garden, and I made her chili jam one time, which she appreciated. The frequency of the food gifts is greater than we really want or need, but I can't think of a way to decline food when she's enthusiastically offering it. Is there anything we can do? We feel a little awkward and indebted to her."

Leah: This was the other one that I felt very uncomfortable about.

Nick: Yeah, this is a little uncomfortable. Yeah. So I think there's two questions here. One question is about how to repay the favor, feeling indebted. And then the other question is: there's too much food and we don't want all of it.

Leah: Yeah.

Nick: So let's tackle the first one. We're feeling indebted. What do we do about that?

Leah: I feel like this is something the neighbor is doing because it makes them happy.

Nick: Yes.

Leah: You've given limes, you've given lemons, you've made chili jam.

Nick: Yeah, that's nice.

Leah: That's nice. You've obviously said thank you. I mean, they're constantly giving you food. You know, I feel like what you've done is nice.

Nick: Yes, you do not have to reciprocate Crock-Pot for Crock-Pot.

Leah: Maybe like a nice little basket of cookies?

Nick: Yeah, I mean, the idea is to express gratitude. And so yes, we're doing that.

Leah: I meant at the end of the year, I didn't mean—because you've already expressed gratitude.

Nick: Sure. So yeah. Okay, I think we're okay on that front. And then we have too much food.

Leah: We have too much food, and we don't—I also imagine you've, like, just cooked dinner. You know what I mean? You probably have your own food that you're eating.

Nick: Right? Luckily, the food is good, so it does help us a little bit that it's not bad food. Because normally when we get this type of question the food is bad.

Leah: Rolling back, I also think we can tell the person—sometimes when we just communicate things, it feels so much better. "You keep bringing us such lovely food. I feel a little awkward because I feel like I'm not reciprocating." And then they'll tell you, "No, I just wanna do this."

Nick: Yes. And just stating that, I think would make you feel better, yeah.

Leah: I think it would make you feel better. And then—but then you have to deal with, "But you could do it a little less." [laughs]

Nick: [laughs] Well, I think for that, I think, you know, you might wanna say something like, "Oh, it's so kind of you to think of us again. We're actually set up for meals for the next couple days," or weeks or months or however many meals this person has brought you. And then I would pivot quickly to, "But we would love to see you. Maybe come over for coffee this weekend." You know? Like, let's pivot our relationship not to purely a food based, but, like, let's just make it clear, like, oh, we appreciate your company. So let's do something with you that's not necessarily you bringing over a casserole.

Leah: I think that's a nice option.

Nick: Right?

Leah: Also, there's another issue that is not in this, but I feel like sometimes it's a thing where people make you food and you don't actually eat that food.

Nick: Sure. Yeah. No, the idea is, like, oh, this gift is really not welcome.

Leah: Because, like, people will offer me things and you're like, "I don't eat gluten. I don't eat—I don't eat red meat." You know what I mean? The list of things. And then, so I don't wanna be like, "Actually," because I don't want to sound like I'm ungrateful, but you're like ...

Nick: "I can't take the beef Wellington."

Leah: I can't have it. I'm too emotionally invested in cows.

Nick: [laughs] So yeah, this is a problem. I mean, luckily our letter-writer doesn't have this problem, but I think ...

Leah: I mean, they could, I just wanna throw that out there. That might've been a thing where there was ...

Nick: That's true, yeah. Is the food actually good?

Leah: I think it's good. It just might not be something that we want to eat on the regular because we have a particular food plan.

Nick: Yeah, I think a very polite, like, "Hey, you're so kind again. Just so you know, we're kind of set for a certain period of time."

Leah: Oh, it feels just so harsh.

Nick: Well, otherwise buy a deep freeze and put it in the garage. I mean, what do you want?

Leah: I wouldn't buy a deep freeze. I don't think I could do it. I don't think I could do it, Nick.

Nick: No? You just want to have casseroles upon casseroles piling up?

Leah: Yes. And I feel like this has probably been a major issue in my life.

Nick: I mean, maybe if you never return their dishes, would that be a strategy?

Leah: I know, but our letter-writer is not gonna do that. They already feel like lemons, limes and jam isn't enough.

Nick: Yeah, okay.

Leah: Which it is, which it is enough.

Nick: But I figure, like, if eventually they run out of Pyrex, then they can't bring you more food. But then they'll pivot to something disposable. All right, so that was an idea.

Leah: I mean, I think that what you're saying is a hundred percent fair. Like, we shouldn't live in a world where we have to take food all the time, but ...

Nick: Okay. Well, I think a lot of people are like you, Leah. So how do we help you? Your neighbor keeps bringing over delicious gluten-free pasta salad.

Leah: You know what I would have to do? I'd have to walk over to her house, and I would have to knock on her door and I would look at her in her wonderful face and I would say, "Hey, I think you're the best. I think you're so kind. I love your food. I can't keep up with it, and I'm feeling guilty. So I just wanted to come over and have a conversation about it."

Nick: Okay. And do you think you could actually do that?

Leah: That I could do, because I'm already explaining that I feel really bad about it. And I love her food and I love the way that she wants to share, but I can't keep up.

Nick: Okay. Yeah, the keeping up, I'm on overwhelm. It's too much. Yeah, I think that honesty, I think that's the type of honesty we're looking for. And I don't think she would be offended by that. Leah clearly loves my pasta salad. It's not about me and my pasta salad. She just has a small kitchen.

Leah: I have a small kitchen.

Nick: There's only so much pantry space.

Leah: There's only so much I can eat, you know what I mean? But I love you to pieces, and I think you're phenomenal.

Nick: Yeah. Okay, I think this is the solution.

Leah: I just have to be messy with my emotions so people know that it's a layered—it's layered.

Nick: Or donate. Could we donate the food?

Leah: That was my first thought when I read it. I was like, "Can we take this somewhere?"

Nick: Yeah, anybody else would enjoy this? No, honest conversation. That's really ...

Leah: We'll have the honest conversation. And I just think it's better face to face, like, not on a text or an email.

Nick: Yeah. Well, I think the next time it's brought over.

Leah: I would do it when there was no food. I would do it in between foods.

Nick: I mean, it sounds like there actually isn't a time that's between foods.

Leah: There must be a time in between feedings, like maybe a 1:00 pm on a Sunday. "Hey, I just wanna talk about this because ..."

Nick: When we're hosing off the trough.

Leah: [laughs] Yes, because I feel, you know, complicated. And here it is.

Nick: "I feel complicated. I have complicated feelings about your bean dip."

Leah: Because I want to eat all of it because you're phenomenal, but I can't keep up.

Nick: Okay. All right. I think this is it. This is it.

Leah: You think so?

Nick: Yeah, I do. Yeah. So our next question is quote. "What do you do when someone is singing 'Happy Birthday' to you?"

Leah: I—when I read this, I was like, "I feel like Nick and I have different experiences of this."

Nick: Yeah. So Leah actually has led "Happy Birthday" to me in front of an audience of a hundred-plus people.

Leah: And this is after I read a poem that I wrote for him.

Nick: About me. [laughs]

Leah: About him.

Nick: Yeah. So that happened, yes. So how do you feel about this?

Leah: I think it's nice when people sing "Happy Birthday," and I just sort of smile and make eye contact. And I kind of do like a shoulder—you know what I mean? I go—like a little dance. I'm doing the—you know, I'm moving along with it, I'm in it. And then ...

Nick: You're grooving to the beat.

Leah: I groove to the beat, and at the end I go, "Thank you! Thank you so much! Thank you!"

Nick: Yeah, I think—I mean, I think not everybody wants to be the center of attention, and it is awkward.

Leah: It is awkward, but even if you don't want to be the center of attention, it's happening, you're in it.

Nick: But also, you don't realize how long that song is. That song is so long!

Leah: Well, hopefully they won't go into, like, a second version of it.

Nick: Is there—is there, like, the long play version?

Leah: Oh, yeah. I could do multiple versions of "Happy Birthday" for my friends.

Nick: Oh, gosh. Okay. But even the traditional version, it's longer than it needs to be.

Leah: It's—I don't want you to express joy about my existence for that long.

Nick: Yeah, it just—it could be cut a little shorter. We could tighten it up. But yes, I think as the recipient of the song, I think you just have to be a good sport.

Leah: Be a good sport.

Nick: And you have to just take it. You just sort of stand there, or I guess groove to the beat if you wanna do the Leah style. But I think we make eye contact around the room. I think we kind of just scan the room, everybody's singing. And then at the end of it, I think we blow out the candles. We kind of try to do that efficiently. And then I think we say thank you. Thank you to everybody for coming, for the birthday wishes, for something. And then that's it.

Leah: There it is.

Nick: That's it. Yeah. But it is awkward.

Leah: I know a lot of people don't like it, which is why when I'm at restaurants, I don't request bring this out and sing because I know a lot of people are uncomfortable with it. But just know that I want to and I'm holding myself back.

Nick: Yeah. I think singing it in public, I don't love the restaurant "Happy Birthday," unless it's the type of restaurant that lends itself to that.

Leah: We had one at El Compadre and we sang along for the stranger.

Nick: Yeah, we did. But that's a restaurant that lends itself to singing "Happy Birthday." And you know the difference. You know the difference between restaurants where this is a thing that's done and a thing that's not done. Like if they have a butter program, it's probably not the type of restaurant.

Leah: [laughs]

Nick: Okay? But apparently the song was invented in, like, the late 1800s. So I guess the question is: what were people doing when it was somebody's birthday before?

Leah: I mean, late 1800s, we're talking—who are we to deny over a century's worth of history and tradition?

Nick: Yeah, not me. I would never—I would never do that. [laughs] Yeah, as you could hear, I don't love the happy birthday song. And it's sort of strange because, like, I don't like to be at the center of attention. Is that what it is? That sounds so strange to say.

Leah: Yeah, because we know that's not true.

Nick: Yeah. Or it's too sincere?

Leah: Is it too sincere? Or is it too loud for you?

Nick: Oh, it's too loud. Maybe it's just that my friends aren't doing it in perfect harmony.

Leah: [laughs] Yeah, maybe if you were like, "If this was a coordinated acapella ..."

Nick: If it was the Mormon Tabernacle Choir.

Leah: I just got excited for Christmas all over again.

Nick: Yeah, if it was them then, like, okay, I'm on board. You can do the long version.

Leah: That's what it is, it's just not high enough caliber for Nick. [laughs]

Nick: You're not good enough. [laughs] Yeah, your singing is just not good enough. That might be the problem. Okay, I think we cracked the code on that. Yeah, it's just not good enough. So you out there, do you have questions for us that are good enough? Let us know! You can let us know through our website. WereYouRaisedByWolves.com, or you can leave us a voicemail or send us a text message: (267) CALL-RBW. And we'll see you next time.

Leah: Bye!

Nick: Bye!